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Author Topic: What do You Hope to Build  (Read 2510 times)

HarpingHawke

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What do You Hope to Build
« on: March 26, 2014, 01:37:38 pm »
I was just reading a bunch of articles on Patheos about what people think Paganism is going to look like in fifty years. What do we want it to be?

Just thought I'd ask you the same question. :)
"There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self." - Hemingway

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2014, 08:50:28 pm »
Quote from: HarpingHawke;143698
I was just reading a bunch of articles on Patheos about what people think Paganism is going to look like in fifty years. What do we want it to be?

Just thought I'd ask you the same question. :)

I'm not sure I want "Paganism" to be anything. I would hope that Pagan religions (and non-majority religions in general) were more acceptable to society in general -- to the point where society no longer tolerated religious prejudice.
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Snowdrop

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2014, 09:16:21 pm »
Quote from: HarpingHawke;143698
I was just reading a bunch of articles on Patheos about what people think Paganism is going to look like in fifty years. What do we want it to be?

Just thought I'd ask you the same question. :)

 
Increased public education, I guess?  I think that visible religious pluralism makes people more aware not just of other religions but also of their own.  When people aren't really emotionally aware that other religions exist, it's easy to be intellectually lazy.  

I have a gift for getting proselytized to a lot, and my experience has been that there are a lot of people out there who genuinely want to talk to others about religion but are really poorly equipped to do so because they don't understand that others might be approaching it from a different perspective.  

My experience has basically been,
Person says thing that only makes sense if you're already Christian
I explain to them why it's incorrect according to Kemeticism
Person looks confused and walks away

I've been surprised by the extent to which doing this doesn't make people angry; they just seem genuinely confused.  I think they're people who never really considered the fact that other religions exist.  

I've been reading some Christian theology from the early-mid 20th century, reacting to the realization of how much of Christian belief resembles other religions of the ancient Near East.  What's interesting is that the theologians weren't angry about that; they recognized it as a real challenge that was making them think more deeply about their faith and what made it different from these other religions.  I'd like to see more of that kind of dialogue.

SunflowerP

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #3 on: March 26, 2014, 11:25:47 pm »
Quote from: HarpingHawke;143698
I was just reading a bunch of articles on Patheos about what people think Paganism is going to look like in fifty years. What do we want it to be?

Just thought I'd ask you the same question. :)

 
I want more awareness that paganism is an umbrella, not a religion or even a set of related religions, but a bunch of religions that might have little or nothing in common with each other at the doctrine/praxis level. And I want that awareness to not just be paying lip service to it as a concept, but fully internalized and active recognition of the reality.

As a corollary to this, I would like to see paganism-the-otherwise-nameless-vaguely-Wiccish-religion being explicitly distinguished from paganism-the-umbrella-movement, to make it harder for people to conflate the two. Distinct names for each would likely help.

In a similar vein, but from a different angle, I want better awareness - and integration - of other sorts of diversity, particularly the social-justice sort.

If these things don't happen, IMO paganism-the-movement will fracture and fragment - it's already happening. And, frankly, if these issues aren't addressed, or are only addressed superficially, good riddance.

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Myst Moonlight

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2014, 01:34:27 pm »
Quote from: RandallS;143740
I'm not sure I want "Paganism" to be anything. I would hope that Pagan religions (and non-majority religions in general) were more acceptable to society in general -- to the point where society no longer tolerated religious prejudice.

 
I agree but I hope pagan religions are all bigger in fifty years, it would be nice to see the newage become bigger in Newfoundland

Altair

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2014, 03:46:06 pm »
Quote from: SunflowerP;143755

As a corollary to this, I would like to see paganism-the-otherwise-nameless-vaguely-Wiccish-religion being explicitly distinguished from paganism-the-umbrella-movement, to make it harder for people to conflate the two. Distinct names for each would likely help.



I use the tongue-in-cheek phrase "tree-hugging pagan" or "tree-hugging neopagan" for myself, as a way to identify myself as a member of that vaguely Wiccish group as distinct from the umbrella term.
The first song sets the wheel in motion / The second is a song of love / The third song tells of Her devotion / The fourth cries joy from the sky above
The fifth song binds our fate to silence / and bids us live each moment well / The sixth unleashes rage and violence / The seventh song has truth to tell
The last song echoes through the ages / to ask its question all night long / And close the circle on these pages / These, the metamythos songs

Arthurine

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #6 on: April 12, 2014, 12:20:45 am »
Quote from: Snowdrop;143743
Increased public education, I guess?  I think that visible religious pluralism makes people more aware not just of other religions but also of their own.  When people aren't really emotionally aware that other religions exist, it's easy to be intellectually lazy.  

I have a gift for getting proselytized to a lot, and my experience has been that there are a lot of people out there who genuinely want to talk to others about religion but are really poorly equipped to do so because they don't understand that others might be approaching it from a different perspective.  

My experience has basically been,
Person says thing that only makes sense if you're already Christian
I explain to them why it's incorrect according to Kemeticism
Person looks confused and walks away

I've been surprised by the extent to which doing this doesn't make people angry; they just seem genuinely confused.  I think they're people who never really considered the fact that other religions exist.  

I've been reading some Christian theology from the early-mid 20th century, reacting to the realization of how much of Christian belief resembles other religions of the ancient Near East.  What's interesting is that the theologians weren't angry about that; they recognized it as a real challenge that was making them think more deeply about their faith and what made it different from these other religions.  I'd like to see more of that kind of dialogue.

 
I second all of this; part of why finding my path has been so hard is a lack of framework in my head; I'm having to really make things up as I go along. Then I hear an idea that makes a lot more sense and I have to tear everything down and start over.

I would really have valued more exposure to various pagan religions (or even learning about more than the one religion I was surrounded with) when I was younger and still first learning about the way the world works.

I'd also like more safe pagan networking methods; before I found you guys I found some really sketchy sites.

   With any luck, I\'ll grow up to be Nanny Ogg.    

missgraceless

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #7 on: April 12, 2014, 11:17:24 am »
Quote from: Arthurine;145066
I second all of this; part of why finding my path has been so hard is a lack of framework in my head; I'm having to really make things up as I go along. Then I hear an idea that makes a lot more sense and I have to tear everything down and start over.

I would really have valued more exposure to various pagan religions (or even learning about more than the one religion I was surrounded with) when I was younger and still first learning about the way the world works.

I'd also like more safe pagan networking methods; before I found you guys I found some really sketchy sites.

You're definitely not alone in making things up as you go. The only thing I'm positive about is that Quan Yin is at the center of my beliefs.

I was lucky enough to grow up with a mother who researched other religions from a scholarly point of view, so I had the exposure from an early age.

I completely agree. WitchVox is an alright site, but not really all that helpful. And here on TC I'm comfortable enough to PM my address for pen pals. Definitely couldn't do that on other sites.
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Altair

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2014, 05:03:55 pm »
Quote from: HarpingHawke;143698
I was just reading a bunch of articles on Patheos about what people think Paganism is going to look like in fifty years. What do we want it to be?

Just thought I'd ask you the same question. :)


I didn't know how to answer this for a long time, until I reframed it as your title for the thread: What do I hope to build?

Answer: A farflung community of folks creating new myth, revitalizing that nearly lost (in the West) genre for those of us for whom it has deeper meaning.
The first song sets the wheel in motion / The second is a song of love / The third song tells of Her devotion / The fourth cries joy from the sky above
The fifth song binds our fate to silence / and bids us live each moment well / The sixth unleashes rage and violence / The seventh song has truth to tell
The last song echoes through the ages / to ask its question all night long / And close the circle on these pages / These, the metamythos songs

dragonfaerie

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2014, 12:48:07 pm »
Quote from: HarpingHawke;143698
I was just reading a bunch of articles on Patheos about what people think Paganism is going to look like in fifty years. What do we want it to be?


I'd like to see more acceptance in the mainstream of religious pluralism. Within the community, I'd like to see less backlash against Wicca, especially the "I used to be Wiccan but I outgrew that" statements.

To that end, I'd like to see the more obscure types of Paganism be more available to the mainstream, so that people don't waste time trying to work with Wicca when it isn't really what they want.

I think a smarter use of the internet, of e-books, and of reasonably-priced on-demand printing will make a good dent in that problem, and I don't think it will take 50 years if we're proactive about it.

And as controversial as this statement may seem, I hope Paganism as a whole loses it's trendiness. Pagan paths aren't fashion statements. They're religions. I think we, as a community (such as it is) need to redouble our efforts to discourage dabblers, denounce play-actors, and steer the seriously-minded seekers towards serious study.

Karen

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2014, 07:01:46 pm »
Quote from: HarpingHawke;143698
I was just reading a bunch of articles on Patheos about what people think Paganism is going to look like in fifty years. What do we want it to be?

 
I like to think that paganism will continue to grow. I really can't see it just petering out- too many people devoted to their gods for it to do that.

As far as the movement, I'd like to see more temples and groves (and other holy sites). I'd also like to see the individual faiths grow, and for the gods to reappear in society.

In all honesty, I'd like to see more faith and prayer in daily life too. There's so much emphasis on "anything goes"- I'd like to see a bit of a resurgence in ethics.

Hah that went somewhere different than I expected... can you tell I'm an idealist? :whis:

Kyndyl

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #11 on: April 21, 2014, 10:56:27 am »
Quote from: Germandragon;145786
I like to think that paganism will continue to grow. I really can't see it just petering out- too many people devoted to their gods for it to do that.

As far as the movement, I'd like to see more temples and groves (and other holy sites). I'd also like to see the individual faiths grow, and for the gods to reappear in society.

In all honesty, I'd like to see more faith and prayer in daily life too. There's so much emphasis on "anything goes"- I'd like to see a bit of a resurgence in ethics.

Hah that went somewhere different than I expected... can you tell I'm an idealist? :whis:

 


build? a LOT.

a Place/Faith where those who are different(trans, two spirit, intersexed, third gender) are accepted. Where the "us or them" divides get tossed out the window.. ex. we're doing it right, no we are  .. no we are.. . A place where people with mental illness/experiences aren't considered lesser or unfit for Service. A place where everyone can experience safety.

those are what I want to build

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #12 on: April 21, 2014, 01:59:54 pm »
Quote from: HarpingHawke;143698
I was just reading a bunch of articles on Patheos about what people think Paganism is going to look like in fifty years. What do we want it to be?

Just thought I'd ask you the same question. :)


Ra once told me that he wants his name known when humans stand under the light of other suns. That means that we all, gods and humans together, have to make it that far. Ambitious much? (I'd like to see lots of gods's names known then too, not just his!)

Lana288

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2014, 08:11:56 pm »
Quote from: Shezep;145876
Ra once told me that he wants his name known when humans stand under the light of other suns. That means that we all, gods and humans together, have to make it that far. Ambitious much? (I'd like to see lots of gods's names known then too, not just his!)

 
That's beautiful. :) I'd love to see that for my own gods as well.

HarpingHawke

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Re: What do You Hope to Build
« Reply #14 on: April 23, 2014, 02:40:26 am »
Quote from: Shezep;145876
Ra once told me that he wants his name known when humans stand under the light of other suns. That means that we all, gods and humans together, have to make it that far. Ambitious much? (I'd like to see lots of gods's names known then too, not just his!)

 
Oh wow. I was nearly out of spoons when I read this, and I didn't quite get it, but now I do, and WOW. That's an amazing goal.

I hope we make it that far. :cf:
"There is nothing noble in being superior to your fellow man; true nobility is being superior to your former self." - Hemingway

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