The Cauldron: A Pagan Forum

All this time I thought Gods controlled/were the forces of nature (ex. Thor is Thunder), and that the giants were outside forces that tried to disrupt that.  

But I was reading in "Giants of Teutonic Religion" that the giants are all forces of nature, and the gods mitigate and control their influence.

"One way that giants are associated with natural forces or events is by “personifying” such forces or events, while deities control or mitigate. Examples of this can be found in the Eddas. For example, the giant Logi is wildfire but the god Njörð stills fire. Another example: the giant Elli is old age, but the god of health and strength (Þórr) slows down its onset (See Gundarsson, 1993a; Karlsdóttir et al, 1993;Young, 1954: 51, 77, 78).

Another function of giants is to automatically cause. Thus, Vindlóni (Wind-Cool) is the (automatic) father of winter, but several deities could be called upon to mitigate weather for human benefit. A giant called Svásuð (Agreeable) is the father of summer, which comes relentlessly year after year. In the OERP Book,Stanfield (2000a) argues that Night and Day are giants. (See also the sidebar, “Sun and Moon”)."

Obviously I feel stupid, but this explains things so much better. Did anyone else have that dynamic backwards? :ashamed:

Tornadoes aren't gods, they're the absence of gods. If they were absent altogether, then Earth would be an environmentally hostile planet. It would just snow and flood and burn like crazy without restraint.

 
That does makes sense! Not that I have read much on the Norse mythology, but generally speaking. *nodnod*

This is really interesting.

I wish I was feeling less zombiefied and could make more intelligent comment than that! :ashamed:

Don't feel too silly...it's not a conceptualization of deities that most of us are used to. Especially in the West, we get taught that the mythological gods were all just explanations of natural forces, and that idea permeates our whole understanding.

I had kind of a "whoa!" moment with this too, and it really ties in with how it's less about Good vs. Evil (if at all) than it is chaos vs. order in Heathenry. It also fits with many of the gods being part giant.

And on a personal note, you really get a sense of this when you're in the middle of serious bad weather. I was on the east coast during Sandy and it was like, "Oh. That's a jotun. Ok. :eek:".

Thanks.

It put a large piece of the puzzle together for me wrt order vs chaos. So much makes sense now.

I'm actually really excited by it.

Eta: And glad you made it through that storm!

So, then, the thunder storm isn't Thor moving across, Thor is fighting that bad ass storm to keep it from doing damage. Tornadoes aren't gods, they're the absence of gods. If they were absent altogether, then Earth would be an environmentally hostile planet. It would just snow and flood and burn like crazy without restraint.

It makes sense, at least to someone like me whose knowledge of Norse mythology is fairly limited.

And on a personal note, you really get a sense of this when you're in the middle of serious bad weather. I was on the east coast during Sandy and it was like, "Oh. That's a jotun. Ok. :eek:".

 
Yep. Ran and her daughters are not to be trifled with.

hahaha! Does someone have a YouTube link for this or something? I haven't seen the movie, but I'm curious as to what you're talking about...

I have no idea! Never seen it (and wishing I had).

As for your original epiphany, I guess... I never really thought about it! Although now that I do, I realize I never felt the gods were "inflicting" natural disasters on us. The whole "punishing mankind with weather" bit common in Christianity never hit a nerve with me.

The way you've pointed it out as extreme weather disasters as the unbridled jotun force to be controlled / managed by the gods makes a lot of sense. That raw energy is necessary for rain, a cool breeze, etc. But too much of a good thing isn't so anymore.

However, I'm probably taking this too literally, but then my next thought is what about global warming and the effects it has as regards to increasing extreme weather events? Does that mean the gods are less involved in it now for some reason?

The article I read explained it as the giants (for the most part) being incapable of thinking in the long term. That's why their actions can be so chaotic and destructive. The gods can think in the longterm, however. So on a literal basis either the gods are losing control and ragnarok is approaching or, in the long term the effects of global warming are necessary.

All this time I thought Gods controlled/were the forces of nature (ex. Thor is Thunder), and that the giants were outside forces that tried to disrupt that.  

But I was reading in "Giants of Teutonic Religion" that the giants are all forces of nature, and the gods mitigate and control their influence.

"One way that giants are associated with natural forces or events is by “personifying” such forces or events, while deities control or mitigate. Examples of this can be found in the Eddas. For example, the giant Logi is wildfire but the god Njörð stills fire. Another example: the giant Elli is old age, but the god of health and strength (Þórr) slows down its onset (See Gundarsson, 1993a; Karlsdóttir et al, 1993;Young, 1954: 51, 77, 78).

Another function of giants is to automatically cause. Thus, Vindlóni (Wind-Cool) is the (automatic) father of winter, but several deities could be called upon to mitigate weather for human benefit. A giant called Svásuð (Agreeable) is the father of summer, which comes relentlessly year after year. In the OERP Book,Stanfield (2000a) argues that Night and Day are giants. (See also the sidebar, “Sun and Moon”)."

Obviously I feel stupid, but this explains things so much better. Did anyone else have that dynamic backwards? :ashamed:

 
Boom, headshot to my worldview. :ashamed: This does make much more sense, even better to explain Ragnarok and how the gods could no longer fend off the giants and undead forces any longer. I'm glad i was turned straight now rather than later.

But how do we explain the Wild Hunt? Odin's charge across the world that supposedly brings catastrophe to the viewer? I am just curious