Author Topic: Religious Research (Read 6720 times)

Bringer_of_Pain1098 · « **on:** October 09, 2012, 05:50:47 pm »

To be honest I'm not pagan I'm a Jashinic priest. Though some might think it pagan while others don't even believe it to be a real religion. But religion is defined as the body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices, so please do not attempt to say my faith isn't a real one. Anyways, I have been conducting research, devoting hours of my time, trying to find out the truth about our creation and of all the gods. I was wandering if anyone would be kind enough to tell me about the god/goddess he/she serves. Their god's/goddess' name; what they are god of; the ways you worship/serve your god/goddess; etc. any and all info is appreciated. Thank you.

Bringer_of_Pain1098 · « **Reply #1 on:** October 09, 2012, 06:14:40 pm »

Quote from: Bringer_of_Pain1098;76246

To be honest I'm not pagan I'm a Jashinic priest. Though some might think it pagan while others don't even believe it to be a real religion. But religion is defined as the body of persons adhering to a particular set of beliefs and practices, so please do not attempt to say my faith isn't a real one. Anyways, I have been conducting research, devoting hours of my time, trying to find out the truth about our creation and of all the gods. I was wandering if anyone would be kind enough to tell me about the god/goddess he/she serves. Their god's/goddess' name; what they are god of; the ways you worship/serve your god/goddess; etc. any and all info is appreciated. Thank you.

I apologize, I'm new to this site and just realized this may have not been the appropriate place to post this question.

Maps · « **Reply #2 on:** October 09, 2012, 09:01:40 pm »

Quote from: Bringer_of_Pain1098;76246

Anyways, I have been conducting research, devoting hours of my time, trying to find out the truth about our creation and of all the gods.

You're gonna be mighty disappointed if you're trying to formulate some unified theory of theistic everything.

I worship Mesoamerican gods in ways that they would recognize as somewhat resembling their pre-Christian worship. Meaning I perform autosacrifice, make traditional offerings, observe old holidays, and see the world through polytheistic eyes... to the best of my ability.

Shine · « **Reply #3 on:** October 09, 2012, 09:37:42 pm »

Quote from: Maps;76258

You're gonna be mighty disappointed if you're trying to formulate some unified theory of theistic everything.

I worship Mesoamerican gods in ways that they would recognize as somewhat resembling their pre-Christian worship. Meaning I perform autosacrifice, make traditional offerings, observe old holidays, and see the world through polytheistic eyes... to the best of my ability.

I guess someone could try to write a Unified Theistic Theory.

But that would force him or her to fit certain deities where they don't belong. For example, in my practice, I believe in the supremacy of the sun, and tend to see the Netjeru in this light (ha, punny). But if I try to apply that same framework to the Hellenic deities, for example, it doesn't fit unless I reduce them to something they're not.

It's also offensive, because gods like Zeus become an emanation of the sun god. And Zeus is. . . not someone I want to offend. D:

Anyway, to the OP, I'm kind of like Maps, except my deities are Kemetic (ancient Egyptian). I perform certain daily rites--shortened forms, but recognizable--give regular libations and offerings, and frame my understanding of the world in polytheistic and polyvalent terms. I don't observe many of the traditional holidays, though. When it comes to calendar observances, I tend to make things up.

Bringer_of_Pain1098 · « **Reply #4 on:** October 09, 2012, 11:23:33 pm »

Quote from: Maps;76258

You're gonna be mighty disappointed if you're trying to formulate some unified theory of theistic everything.

I worship Mesoamerican gods in ways that they would recognize as somewhat resembling their pre-Christian worship. Meaning I perform autosacrifice, make traditional offerings, observe old holidays, and see the world through polytheistic eyes... to the best of my ability.

To do so would be something, but I believe it to be near impossible to do so. Even if one did there would be those who would continue to disagree with it no matter how logical it may be. I simply wish to understand others beliefs and as to why they believe in what they do, so as to not judge others in anyway. I believe that understanding others is the first step one must take to find peace with them self and the world. As for who I serve, my god is Lord Jashin. God of pain, death and renewal, destruction, and dreams. My favorite way to worship my Lord is through sacrificing my own blood but I also fast and do daily pray to my Lord. Our main commandment is to never inflict pain unto anyone unless you have experienced that pain before. However if you have experienced that pain then you would not wish to inflict it on someone else because you know how it feels. My faith is based on the understanding of others and abolishing those who wish to do nothing but cause pain to others thus resulting in a world where people understand each other and wish not to inflict pain or sorrow on anyone bringing peace to the world

Maps · « **Reply #5 on:** October 09, 2012, 11:29:18 pm »

Quote from: Bringer_of_Pain1098;76268

You might be better off hanging around the forums and reading a bunch of threads--the religious SIGs mostly--instead of asking people to give an elevator speech about their beliefs.

Laveth · « **Reply #6 on:** October 09, 2012, 11:37:31 pm »

Quote from: Bringer_of_Pain1098;76268

To do so would be something, but I believe it to be near impossible to do so. Even if one did there would be those who would continue to disagree with it no matter how logical it may be. I simply wish to understand others beliefs and as to why they believe in what they do, so as to not judge others in anyway. I believe that understanding others is the first step one must take to find peace with them self and the world. As for who I serve, my god is Lord Jashin. God of pain, death and renewal, destruction, and dreams. My favorite way to worship my Lord is through sacrificing my own blood but I also fast and do daily pray to my Lord. Our main commandment is to never inflict pain unto anyone unless you have experienced that pain before. However if you have experienced that pain then you would not wish to inflict it on someone else because you know how it feels. My faith is based on the understanding of others and abolishing those who wish to do nothing but cause pain to others thus resulting in a world where people understand each other and wish not to inflict pain or sorrow on anyone bringing peace to the world

Just a thought, you might get more responses if you create an introduction post. The jumping directly into the creation of this thread without reading through all the forums already posted seems a little... forward? :confused:

Elani Temperance · « **Reply #7 on:** October 10, 2012, 01:27:36 am »

Quote from: Shine;76262

I'm kind of like Maps, except my deities are Kemetic (ancient Egyptian). I perform certain daily rites--shortened forms, but recognizable--give regular libations and offerings, and frame my understanding of the world in polytheistic and polyvalent terms.

I'm kind of like Maps, too, but my deities are from the Hellenic (Greek) pantheon. I perform daily rites in the morning and evening and sometimes inbetween, I celebrate the festivals the ancient Hellens celebrated and I perform ritual for the Gods in a way they would have recognized. I, like Maps and Shine, frame my understanding of the world in polytheistic terms, and try to see the Gods in everything. As a big part of Hellenismos is ethics and moral codes, this is what a lot of time gets devoted to as well. I hope this helps.

Faemon · « **Reply #8 on:** October 10, 2012, 02:46:46 am »

Quote from: Bringer_of_Pain1098;76246

I have been conducting research, devoting hours of my time, trying to find out the truth about our creation and of all the gods. I was wandering if anyone would be kind enough to tell me about the god/goddess he/she serves. Their god's/goddess' name; what they are god of; the ways you worship/serve your god/goddess; etc. any and all info is appreciated. Thank you.

My spiritual practice is based on meditation and similar altered mind-states. The first thing I believe in, is an other-world only accessible through perception. Sometimes, in that perception, I sense... people, that I sometimes feel that I recognize from stories that I've read. (Here, called the lore.)

I would not be surprised if they were, so to speak, all in my mind-- and there was no other world and no gods. But right now, I work with my experience. So, I believe I've met quite a few gods, of quite a few things (the ocean, the ocean in another sense and truth and memory, ducks and the sun, prophecy and music and the sun, women and the moon and the wilderness, women and the moon and roads trod in a specific sort of organic geometric pattern, fire and trickster...ing, thunder and goats, fate and maybe knitting), who take appreciation in all sorts of ways or (like in the case of the Fates, who seemed to be very cold and all-business without necessarily any transaction) not at all-- maybe whatever "errand" they move me to do, it's enough that it supported their cause from their perspective.

My philosophy and morality might be influenced by, but not based on, any one god from one belief system. I looked up Jashinism, for example, and while I've never met Jashin-sama, I have suffered (both outside and self-inflicted) and cut people off who don't empathize, in the past. Now I'm more of a hedonist, because that's just the resonance right now.

I've kept trying to type or write out something about the overarching philosophy behind the balance between power, morality and spirituality... it hasn't been turning out well. It's like something's missing that would let me say what I mean, or something.

RandallS · « **Reply #9 on:** October 10, 2012, 08:15:29 am »

Quote from: Bringer_of_Pain1098;76246

Anyways, I have been conducting research, devoting hours of my time, trying to find out the truth about our creation and of all the gods.

I think this is a lost cause. A single factual truth about the origins of the universe and of humans is probably best found in science not in religion as most religions do not really speak to those types of truth -- religious creation stories are more about our relationship to the universe and the gods; the "why" of creation not the "how" of creation. And there probably isn't any single truth about the gods to find. Each pantheon and each god are different, sometimes very different, from others in their drives, needs, and even how/why they interact with mortals.

IceAngie · « **Reply #10 on:** October 10, 2012, 10:42:22 am »

Quote from: Bringer_of_Pain1098;76268

My faith is based on the understanding of others and abolishing those who wish to do nothing but cause pain to others thus resulting in a world where people understand each other and wish not to inflict pain or sorrow on anyone bringing peace to the world

This makes no sense, unless is a twisted kind of sense. I googled Jashinism and I got to the church of Lord Jashin, where I found this:

Quote

We believe that everyone who is not Jashinist is an atheist.

We believe that Lord Jashin has commanded us to try and convert other people peacefully, and if that fails we are to use violence to convert them, and if they do not convert we must kill them.

We believe that Lord Jashin has commanded us to kill all atheists.

We believe that Lord Jashin has commanded us to kill anyone we fight against, and that we are to bring nothing less than utter destruction and chaos to the world.

I also found that on the Jashin article on the Narutopedia.

Maps · « **Reply #11 on:** October 10, 2012, 11:48:40 am »

Quote from: IceAngie;76285

Yeah it also doesn't make much sense to worship a singular god of death, destruction, pain, and evil (his name apparently means "Evil One") if what you're after is peace, love, and understanding. But what do I know. :whis:

(Are there any Jashinists over the age of 20 is what I -really- want to know, though.)

Laveth · « **Reply #12 on:** October 10, 2012, 12:43:04 pm »

Quote from: Maps;76292

Yeah it also doesn't make much sense to worship a singular god of death, destruction, pain, and evil (his name apparently means "Evil One") if what you're after is peace, love, and understanding. But what do I know. :whis:

(Are there any Jashinists over the age of 20 is what I -really- want to know, though.)

I'd like to know this too. Spent an hour last night looking for resources describing Jashinism, and while I fully respect the beliefs of others, this one had a lot of red flags in my eyes (so basically, I wouldn't be looking into it for my own sake).

Particularly the vocabulary used by its followers in all the half dozen forums I found, the age group ranging from 12-19, and the insistence that the deity itself is based of ancient Japanese mythology, but I couldn't for the life of me find any resources of credible merit from any Japanese mythology sites claiming that this was true.

The biggest red flag for me though, was the insistence of blood letting being a required form of prayer. For an adult, it's not my place to say. For requiring this for minors and saying things like "ignore the fact that your mother says you can't cut yourself, do it anyway" is a huge red flag to me.

The other major issue, is that there states on several sites that Jashinists view all other people as atheists, regardless of their particular beliefs. That all atheists must be converted or killed. And the promise of immortality from spells including a gallon of human blood and a body sacrifice.

Many of these statements might be made in jest, or in the spirit of the 'lore' (I haven't read Naruto, I don't know the lore), but when directed at impressionable minors... it makes me a bit edgy.

My two cents, I didn't want to post last night lest I be accused of being a flamer or instigating an argument or insulting, but I figured I'd save others the preliminary legwork. If I'm misinterpreting anything, or missing anything, by all means share your insight.

Maps · « **Reply #13 on:** October 10, 2012, 01:41:54 pm »

Quote from: Laveth;76295

I'd like to know this too. Spent an hour last night looking for resources describing Jashinism, and while I fully respect the beliefs of others, this one had a lot of red flags in my eyes (so basically, I wouldn't be looking into it for my own sake).

Particularly the vocabulary used by its followers in all the half dozen forums I found, the age group ranging from 12-19, and the insistence that the deity itself is based of ancient Japanese mythology, but I couldn't for the life of me find any resources of credible merit from any Japanese mythology sites claiming that this was true.

The biggest red flag for me though, was the insistence of blood letting being a required form of prayer. For an adult, it's not my place to say. For requiring this for minors and saying things like "ignore the fact that your mother says you can't cut yourself, do it anyway" is a huge red flag to me.

The other major issue, is that there states on several sites that Jashinists view all other people as atheists, regardless of their particular beliefs. That all atheists must be converted or killed. And the promise of immortality from spells including a gallon of human blood and a body sacrifice.

Many of these statements might be made in jest, or in the spirit of the 'lore' (I haven't read Naruto, I don't know the lore), but when directed at impressionable minors... it makes me a bit edgy.

My two cents, I didn't want to post last night lest I be accused of being a flamer or instigating an argument or insulting, but I figured I'd save others the preliminary legwork. If I'm misinterpreting anything, or missing anything, by all means share your insight.

I read somewhere that Jashinism gained popularity outside of Japan due to the actions of the initial cult inspired by a religion that a fictional character from Naruto believed in. They apparently acted more or less like the nutty "Satanists" we have here in the west who go out abusing animals and participating in self-harm, which culminated in a mass suicide. Wouldn't be surprised if it was some kind of urban legend, though, either made up by internet trolls to discredit, or Jashinists to give themselves some history and credence.

I have a lot of issues stemming from the uninformed and casual practice of ritual bloodletting, especially by minors, as it's an enormous cornerstone of my practice and should ALWAYS be done with care and a healthy intention. So when it's lumped in with flippant remarks about violence, abuse, and murder, then I'm going to be extremely hard-pressed to take that practice seriously. That is, until some idiot does something awful in its name.

Maps · « **Reply #14 on:** October 10, 2012, 02:05:28 pm »

Quote from: Maps;76298

Ah, okay apparently this mass suicide rumor has to do with Jashinists in the manga, I think.

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