Hypothetical power robing spell, from the Lady Z thread.

[Wickerman]

Start a thread for it on one of the magic forums here and have fun.

This could be done, I'm not sure how much actual spell principals we're allowed to discuss on here so I won't go into detail unless someone gives me permission. But it wouldn't be about strength, just knowledge, or really understanding. In theory it would be fairly simple, but getting everything right would be complicated. Also there is that whole Karma thing to worry about, since the act would be akin to writing a computer virus. I'm up for a hypothetical discussion of how such a chant/spell might be put together, anyone else game?

Absurd though the whole thing is, taken out of context it's an elegant idea... construct a charm so finely crafted that any effort to modify it triggers hidden traps... sing a song so esoterically composed that any improper performance brings a result opposite to its first intent.

The stuff of fiction - I can't imagine any mages of this caliber in our world today - but interesting in its own way.

I know that's a lot of quotes, and I may not have quoted everyone that has had input in this idea. If I missed you I am sorry.

I have some thought on how this might be done. It would be built something like this. Three shells. An outer superficial shell that mostly worked the same way whether it was changed or not. A second shell that only worked when performed exactly as written, and third shell that was innate to the chant and could not be changed (because changing it would make it a different chant).

The outer shell is the actual words to the chant, they/it is designed to illicit an emotional response. It would not need to be magical at all. The second shell is a trigger that releases the raised power. The third shell raises power, and then triggers a redirect of the power back to the mage who wrote it. The trigger in the second shell would activate a few beats before the trigger in the third shell.
I think that I need to explain, at least briefly, a magical method before going on as some folks might not be familiar with it. That is the method of constructing a magical sigil. Basically you write out the spell, then you use a method to reduce that spell to a shorter form. The method that I was taught used numerology. You reduced each significant part of the spell to a single number. Then using a magical square you draw the sigil for that spell.



2 7 6
9 5 1
4 3 8

The first number, you circle, then draw a line to your next number and so forth ending with an arrow over the last number. Erase the numbers from the square and the strange shaped glyph is the sigil for that spell. Note the order of the numbers in the square, if you add each column, the total is 15. If you add each line the total again is 15. If you add the numbers in the two 3 digit diagonals the total is again 15.
Our second shell in the chant is a sigil, but instead of drawing it we are going to weave this number sequence into the words of the chant. Each words numerological reduction will correspond with the numerology for the sigil. The spell here is a trigger. Just like in the military, when a command is given it is given in two parts. First the command, then the trigger. Forward, March. Where the troops do nothing on the word forward, but react to the word march. This layer is one of two triggers, it triggers raised energy to be released into what ever the user of the chant is trying to do. Because it is a complex numerological sequence, it is the sum of the entire chant. If one word is changed it doesn't trigger.
The third shell is also a sigil. It is designed the same as the other, but it is woven into the tune of the chant. The spell here is a power raising spell, and is itself a chant, a few digits repeated over and over. Until the end, which is another trigger, and another sigil that represents the mage or coven that wrote the chant.

The way it would work if done right. The chant is performed, the outer shell provides a false emotional feeling of power. The third shell raises power. The chant nears the end, and the trigger in the second shell activates releasing the raised power into what ever the coven is doing. A few beats later the trigger in the third shell activates, directing what ever power is left back to the mage who wrote the chant.

The way it works if changed or done wrong. The chant is performed with a changed word. The outer shell provides a false emotional feeling of power. The third shell raises power, the chant nears the end, and the numerological sequence in the second shell is broken and that trigger doesn't activate. A few beats later the trigger in the third shell activates, directing what ever power is left ( in this case all of it) back to the mage who wrote the chant.

I haven't written the spells yet, but they seem simple enough, weaving the one into the tune is going to be tough, but it is a repetition, until the last line.

So what do you think?

[Hadrien]

I

I haven't written the spells yet, but they seem simple enough, weaving the one into the tune is going to be tough, but it is a repetition, until the last line.

So what do you think?

It does seem simple enough from what you described here, again I must say that magic of this kind isn't something I know much about, but I am curious, what is to keep someone else from hijacking this spell? Is there anything built into this to keep someone else from dumping something bad back at you? What happens if the energy raised by this spell is damaging, or doesn't interact well with the mage who created it?

I like the way the structure and the layers work by the way that you described them,
But is it possible for this to backfire, or be tampered with and then for there to be a clear line of transmission back to the creator?

Just figured I'd ask as this occurred to me.
-Hadrien

[Ravaris]

It does seem simple enough from what you described here, again I must say that magic of this kind isn't something I know much about, but I am curious, what is to keep someone else from hijacking this spell? Is there anything built into this to keep someone else from dumping something bad back at you? What happens if the energy raised by this spell is damaging, or doesn't interact well with the mage who created it?

I like the way the structure and the layers work by the way that you described them,
But is it possible for this to backfire, or be tampered with and then for there to be a clear line of transmission back to the creator?

Just figured I'd ask as this occurred to me.
-Hadrien

I agree with Hadrien; those of use who do energy work as opposed to magic understand that you can't focus something like this on one person and expect there to not be backlash. All I would have to do is focus harmful negative energy down the path that is provided by the natural flow of the spell. And energy work isn't one off I can keep forcing for an hour maybe more if I wanted to. If I understand how this works correctly as long as I don't brake away to rest after the initial burst the spell would keep channeling the energy back to the creator.

I could be wrong so if I am please correct me but I would not recommend doing this unless you are crazy powerful. The other issue here that the spell creator might not be able to handle some kinds of energy that would otherwise be harmless to others. If this is the case as I find it is sometimes then this could backfire without the castor intending it to.

But I don't know as much about magic as I would like so let's get some other conversation going about this. As I said feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

[RandallS]

I agree with Hadrien; those of use who do energy work as opposed to magic understand that you can't focus something like this on one person and expect there to not be backlash. All I would have to do is focus harmful negative energy down the path that is provided by the natural flow of the spell.

I'm not sure I really understand what this spell is trying to do, so I'm just replying to what you have said here.

Energy is energy to me. If I'm collecting it somehow, whether you send (what you consider) negative, neutral, or positive energy, I'm going to just add it to the collection and use it for what I want. This doesn't take a lot of effort or magical knowledge either, you just run the energy through the magical equivalent of a rectifier to make it all nice and neutral. That's what my shields do all the time.

[Ravaris]

I'm not sure I really understand what this spell is trying to do, so I'm just replying to what you have said here.

Energy is energy to me. If I'm collecting it somehow, whether you send (what you consider) negative, neutral, or positive energy, I'm going to just add it to the collection and use it for what I want. This doesn't take a lot of effort or magical knowledge either, you just run the energy through the magical equivalent of a rectifier to make it all nice and neutral. That's what my shields do all the time.

I'm going to resist my urge to nitpick your energy is energy comment because I disagree slightly with you but you are right in that your shield could easily convert the energy.

But the spell as I understand it is a booby trap spell; you give it to someone and tell them that it amplifies energy for spell work or energy work. But when they cast it, it gives them the illusion that they are being ampted and instead transfers the energy to the spell maker. And if I understand it correctly this would bypass any shield because the spell sends the energy directly to the spell maker. I could be wrong but that is how I understood it.

[Darkhawk]

And if I understand it correctly this would bypass any shield because the spell sends the energy directly to the spell maker. I could be wrong but that is how I understood it.

... someone who siphons energy without a filter on it is an idiot.

[Ravaris]

... someone who siphons energy without a filter on it is an idiot.

Uhh OK?

I'm not sure what your trying to say. Are you saying that the OP would be using a filter because that's just common sense?

Are you calling the OP an idiot because he may not be using a filter?

Or are you calling me an idiot for even considering that someone casting a spell would not use a filter?

[Darkhawk]

Uhh OK?

I'm not sure what your trying to say. Are you saying that the OP would be using a filter because that's just common sense?

Well, I would certainly hope so. Because just taking in anything one comes across willy-nilly is a terrible idea.

Someone who constructs a spell to energy-vampirise another person and doesn't pass that energy through their shields or otherwise protect themselves from the results is pretty likely to get something unpleasant out of it, and I'm sure not gonna find it in my heart to feel sorry for them.

[Ravaris]

Well, I would certainly hope so. Because just taking in anything one comes across willy-nilly is a terrible idea.

Someone who constructs a spell to energy-vampirise another person and doesn't pass that energy through their shields or otherwise protect themselves from the results is pretty likely to get something unpleasant out of it, and I'm sure not gonna find it in my heart to feel sorry for them.

I see thank you for clearing that up. I think the OP could pull this off I just hope that you know what your doing and don't mess with the wrong person. I find energy is never as predictable as one might think. Then again I don't know that the OP is going to do this so it might just be a curiosity.

[RandallS]

And if I understand it correctly this would bypass any shield because the spell sends the energy directly to the spell maker. I could be wrong but that is how I understood it.

Only if they are silly enough to be accepting energy without a filter. I would expect anyone able to actually do something like this to pretty much have had some type of energy filter in place for quite a while.