TWS: Elements Path

[FierFlye]

Discuss topics and experiences specific to the Elements Path of The Twelve Wild Swans here.

Some things to get us started:

1. The book suggests that what we've lost is our connection with nature. Bad history and myths of lost matriarchal societies aside, how do you feel about that statement? Do you agree or disagree? If you agree, how has it been lost?

2. Do you feel that creating sacred space is a necessary or helpful part of personal ritual? What is your definition of sacred space?

3. How do you feel about the ideas of Talking Self, Younger Self, and Deep Self? Are these useful metaphors to you?

4. How do you feel about working with the elements? Do you feel more connected with one over the others?



5. How do you feel about the exercises? Do you plan to do them? Are there ones that do not seem useful or relevant? Once you have done them, how did it go? Was it helpful? Did you learn or feel anything?

6. Which parts of the chapter did you struggle the most with? Which parts were easy?

[Tana]

1. The book suggests that what we've lost is our connection with nature. Bad history and myths of lost matriarchal societies aside, how do you feel about that statement? Do you agree or disagree? If you agree, how has it been lost?

Tho' I'm not working on the Elements Path with the book, I think I give my pov to some of these questions anyway.

The question is tricky. Because they are more levels to it, so it can't be answered with a 'yay' or 'nay'.

For one thing there is an estrangement for most humans in our way of life. Caused by the misunderstanding of separation. But Human is part of nature. Human is animal. So - in that regard - we can not really lose the connection to nature, because nature is ingrained in us. We have instincts, we function to animal behaviour patterns, that are common to all of the human species.

The losing of connection happened in our oh so highly praised brains.
We do 'think' we are above nature. We do 'think' we are not animals. We do 'think' we are not part of this world. In the consequence of this, we don't feel the pain and damage we cause to the web, we are part of. Either we trivialize nature and nature connection, or we play it down to a haughty 'Mama Earth' way, or we ignore it.

What we really lost is not the connection. It's the awareness. The understanding.

2. Do you feel that creating sacred space is a necessary or helpful part of personal ritual? What is your definition of sacred space?

In earlier days, I would've thought it necessary. More out of the feeling of needing protection. Now I think that special places are nice and practical, because they help us to connect easier, if we use them consistently. And it does make sense to cut out a special area to access the Underworld within its circumferences.

3. How do you feel about the ideas of Talking Self, Younger Self, and Deep Self? Are these useful metaphors to you?

I don't think it is a metaphor, but its the way our threefold soul is organized. Just found the very beautiful names of 'Surface Walker', 'Dream Walker' and 'Star Walker' for it in Orion Foxwood's book.

The concept of the three selves is surfacing in different systems and for me it makes absolute sense.

4. How do you feel about working with the elements? Do you feel more connected with one over the others?

If you'd asked me this a few years ago I might have said: yes, fire and earth. But after working with the elements for so long now, I think I balanced out.

The element work itself is something I really like and think beneficial.

[FierFlye]

1. The book suggests that what we've lost is our connection with nature. Bad history and myths of lost matriarchal societies aside, how do you feel about that statement? Do you agree or disagree? If you agree, how has it been lost?

I agree to some extent. Tana makes a good point about being a part of nature. But I think many of us have lost our knowledge of nature cycles, how food is grown, how different ecosystems are important, ect.

2. Do you feel that creating sacred space is a necessary or helpful part of personal ritual? What is your definition of sacred space?

I would say that all space is sacred. But designating a space for ritual, even temporarily, I can see that being helpful.

3. How do you feel about the ideas of Talking Self, Younger Self, and Deep Self? Are these useful metaphors to you?

I think I have lost Younger Self and Deep Self. So it could be helpful to work to find them

Ran out of time; I'll answer the rest later.

[veggiewolf]

...

1. The book suggests that what we've lost is our connection with nature. Bad history and myths of lost matriarchal societies aside, how do you feel about that statement? Do you agree or disagree? If you agree, how has it been lost?

(It actually took some significant work for me not to close the book and shelve it during the Mother Goddess & matriarchal society discourse.)

Western civilization, as a whole, has created a situation in which one must actively cultivate connection with nature - it is no longer a given. Most of our routine activities are not connected to the rotation of the planet, or the phase of the moon, or our revolution around the sun.

However, I don't think connection to nature is the be-all, end-all thing we're missing...nor do I think it is the only thing that needs to be fixed.

2. Do you feel that creating sacred space is a necessary or helpful part of personal ritual? What is your definition of sacred space?

I think for some people, in some situations, it can be helpful, and I agree that it is a good "life skill"...for lack of better terminology. I've not cast a circle in years, since my current path doesn't require it. However, when I do speak with my gods, I am in sacred space - my mindset becomes sacred rather than making sacred "physical" space.

3. How do you feel about the ideas of Talking Self, Younger Self, and Deep Self? Are these useful metaphors to you?

The metaphors are useful for me, although for some reason I dislike the term "Younger Self". I don't disagree with the description, though. To me, Younger Self is selfish - it is what it wants, all is reality, all is NOW, NOW, NOW.

4. How do you feel about working with the elements? Do you feel more connected with one over the others?

I have a hard time connecting with Earth. Fire, Water, and Air come more easily. I have a feeling that this is because, to me, transformation comes through Fire, or Water, or Air - all of them flow, all change from moment to moment. Earth seems less active and less transient somehow - and my Self worries about stagnation and being backed into corners.

5. How do you feel about the exercises? Do you plan to do them? Are there ones that do not seem useful or relevant? Once you have done them, how did it go? Was it helpful? Did you learn or feel anything?

I've not decided on whether to do the exercises yet, but I probably will. I will not be incorporating any group work.

6. Which parts of the chapter did you struggle the most with? Which parts were easy?

The most difficult part was realizing that the concepts could be useful in spite of my not being a "Goddess-Worshiper". Once I got over that hump, the rest of the chapter went more easily.

[Sperran]

Discuss topics and experiences specific to the Elements Path of The Twelve Wild Swans here.

Some things to get us started:

1. The book suggests that what we've lost is our connection with nature. Bad history and myths of lost matriarchal societies aside, how do you feel about that statement? Do you agree or disagree? If you agree, how has it been lost??

I don't know about the collective we, but I have. I find myself doing things like looking on the computer to see how cold it is instead of just stepping out the front door. Sometimes I go an entire weekend without leaving my house at all. And it is sapping me and my health.

2. Do you feel that creating sacred space is a necessary or helpful part of personal ritual? What is your definition of sacred space?

Yes, it is necessary to clear my head and get out of the crazy hectic head space I inhabit a lot to get anything out of rituals. That's why I love Shabbat. It is complete peace, a time out of time.

3. How do you feel about the ideas of Talking Self, Younger Self, and Deep Self? Are these useful metaphors to you?

Not so useful to me. A little too much like Id, Ego, Superego for my tastes.

4. How do you feel about working with the elements? Do you feel more connected with one over the others?

I've always felt more connected with earth, but since I've been reframing some of the elements with a Jewish framework, I think that I might be more successful at connecting with air than I ever have before. Breath is a form of air, and breath is connected directly to spirit for us. Our spirit literally came to us when God breathed life into us. Our spirit is the breath of God.
5. How do you feel about the exercises? Do you plan to do them? Are there ones that do not seem useful or relevant? Once you have done them, how did it go? Was it helpful? Did you learn or feel anything?

6. Which parts of the chapter did you struggle the most with? Which parts were easy

[Sperran]

6. Which parts of the chapter did you struggle the most with? Which parts were easy

Ooops, missed this one. I will have to come back for this one.

[FierFlye]

4. How do you feel about working with the elements? Do you feel more connected with one over the others?

I feel like I'm a water and earth person. Air is the most difficult for me. I don't quite grok all the associations, and don't feel very connected at all.

I've actually been flailing a bit with it for the past week. I've been thinking about how the region in which I live is very wet and earthy. And flat. Yeah, we have wind, but it's just not very 'airy'. When I was in Colorado, on top of a mountain, THAT was air. I felt it there. Here, I struggle with how to connect.

Tonight I had a mini breakthrough. After my riding lesson I was walking the horses back to the barn when another rider points to the sky. The aurora borealis. Whoa.

[Sperran]

I feel like I'm a water and earth person. Air is the most difficult for me. I don't quite grok all the associations, and don't feel very connected at all.

I recently had a breakthrough with air as well, when I realized that air is breath and, in my tradition our souls and spirits are literally composed of God's breath. So that essence that cannot be touched and makes me the person I am is connected with air.

[veggiewolf]

... I don't quite grok all the associations, and don't feel very connected at all...

You might need to toss out the associations the authors use and find your own. I cannot connect Air to knowledge, f'ex, but I have no trouble when I connect it to life, or transformation, or journeying.

[FierFlye]

5. How do you feel about the exercises? Do you plan to do them? Are there ones that do not seem useful or relevant? Once you have done them, how did it go? Was it helpful? Did you learn or feel anything?

Last night I practiced circle casting and the grounding exercise.

What I got from the grounding exercise was this: I can play around over here, I can play around over there, I can move this way or that way, but I'm not going to fall over because I'm firmly rooted. I'm safe and secure. Also: it's important to grow a foundation before spreading out.

The circle casting I did three times, with three different tools (a wooden wand, a bicycle spoke, and a bamboo staff). I didn't invoke any energies or spirits, I just focused on creating the container and taking it down. I didn't notice any different between the tools; I didn't really care much for any of them. I didn't really notice any change in the space with or without a circle. I did feel like something was missing from the act of casting, but I'm not sure what.